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Polarbear Expert Vidder

Joined: 26 Jun 2005 Posts: 13684 Location: having a bowl of brown with Davos
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Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 12:58 am Post subject: |
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Yeah same as Sarah although I do think MIB has been screwed over by Jacob so I feel sorry for him in a way although he has killed people unneccesarily and is a bit crazy.
I like the biblical references. There's just this podcast I used to listen to where they would jump on EVERYTHING and try and make it about religion. Really irritating. That's why I hope it doesn't have a literal biblical story and it is just an analogy. _________________
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Brooke Expert Vidder
Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 24129
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Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:14 am Post subject: |
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If he is 'evil'. Then why let him be free?
And who's to say Jacob made him evil, I don't think Jacob is 'forcing him to be evil'. I think he is evil.
They way I got it...The Island is not 'hell'. It's a cork that keeps hell from going to the rest of the world, why would anyone want hell to be leaked out?
And MIB is killing everyone who wont serve his purpose, that's pretty awful if you ask me. He slaughters them. You only live if he can use you. Richard he saw could be used as a tool to kill Jacob. I still don't really know what he saw in Locke...Same for Ben, he saw that Ben would kill Jacob.
The episode was odd to me because I thought the Hurley/Isabella/Richard scene was just cheesy and awkward. Also, I don't see Richard as a representative to Jacob because he doesn't interact with anyone. Wasn't that the deal? He had to help people to be 'good', but I haven't seen it. You'd think he'd have to do that to the candidate. So I think that was forced.
MIB has to retort to manipulation and having his 'team members' being crazy.
Who's to say Jacob really did that to MIB especially if it's coming out of MIB's mouth.
Perhaps 'being killed' is what can kill Jacob. He can't be killed naturally. |
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soapbubbles511 Expert Vidder

Joined: 03 Nov 2008 Posts: 8959
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Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:35 am Post subject: |
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yeah but I'm not convinced MIB is evil... or that Jacob is any more trustworthy
I mean how many people died in crashes because Jacob was bringing people to the island... before MIB/Smokey could even get to them... there were lots more people on just 815 that didn't survive the crash.... and for what?
it feels like some big twisted game that Jacob and MIB have been playing for who knows how long _________________
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Polarbear Expert Vidder

Joined: 26 Jun 2005 Posts: 13684 Location: having a bowl of brown with Davos
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Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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Characters do lie sometimes. Up to this point though MIB has been very straight with everyone so I don't think he's lying. I certainly believe he was a regular human being before he was the smoke monster and I'm pretty certain Jacob was the one who made him that way. You have to accept sometimes that the writers are just trying to give us some backstory that will pay off later.
Like Sarah says how many lives have been lost due to Jacob bringing people to the island? To protect something that might very well not need protecting it has yet to be seen. Also he let his own followers get slaughtered by smokey and only saved Jack and Hurley because they were candidates. _________________
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Brooke Expert Vidder
Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 24129
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Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 11:27 pm Post subject: |
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I don't think MIB is that honest. I think he omits things, and tells people what they want to hear. He is manipulating everyone he's around to get what he wants. He lets people live in order to get his way, and he kills the rest. |
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rbexter93 Expert Vidder

Joined: 24 Mar 2006 Posts: 3270
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Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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I'm team MIB. The writers can't keep Jacob so mysterious and wierd whilst giving us awesomeness in the form of Flocke!! They wouldn't spend so much time trying to humanise him if he was totally evil...
I'm kind of hoping it won't have a religious explanation. I really like the theory that they are both two parts of a whole or "ying and yang" better than if one is a God and the other the Devil. _________________
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Charlies_Innocence Expert Vidder

Joined: 24 Nov 2007 Posts: 4410 Location: down a rabbit hole
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 3:45 am Post subject: |
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I don't really think they're humanizing MIB... At least, it doesn't feel that way to me, maybe that's just my opinion. He just feels really fake to me. _________________
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Brooke Expert Vidder
Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 24129
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 4:51 am Post subject: |
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Charlies_Innocence wrote: | I don't really think they're humanizing MIB... At least, it doesn't feel that way to me, maybe that's just my opinion. He just feels really fake to me. |
He feels fake to me too. I don't see how someone who pretends to be other people is all that 'real'.
I also don't buy a lot of what he says.
I am assuming that MIB that is shown is most likely someone who died and he took over their body. |
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Polarbear Expert Vidder

Joined: 26 Jun 2005 Posts: 13684 Location: having a bowl of brown with Davos
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 5:02 am Post subject: |
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But why do you trust Jacob so much? We've hardly seen much of him. I still see him as the leader of the others who remain a very bad group of individuals in my eyes.
I would be willing to bet anything to say that MIB was a man originally.. his soul that is. I also reckon his Titus Welliver form is his original human form as he had no reason to appear that way to either Jacob or Richard. He's only stuck in a form once Jacob is dead.
I'm not saying MIB is good in any sense of the word. I just feel like he is a victim of circumstance. This idea that one has to be good and one has to be bad is too simplistic for Lost. _________________
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Brooke Expert Vidder
Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 24129
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 5:20 am Post subject: |
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Polarbear wrote: | But why do you trust Jacob so much? We've hardly seen much of him. I still see him as the leader of the others who remain a very bad group of individuals in my eyes.
I would be willing to bet anything to say that MIB was a man originally.. his soul that is. I also reckon his Titus Welliver form is his original human form as he had no reason to appear that way to either Jacob or Richard. He's only stuck in a form once Jacob is dead.
I'm not saying MIB is good in any sense of the word. I just feel like he is a victim of circumstance. This idea that one has to be good and one has to be bad is too simplistic for Lost. |
I feel that the original MIB was dead because he's a smoke monster too. It's just an opinion.
I don't trust MIB because he's extremely manipulative. The same reason I didn't trust Ben either. He's using people to get what he wants and he doesn't care about that person he's using, as long as he gets what he wants. He also kills people.
He continues to manipulate Claire, feeding her lies. I just don't get how that's good.
And just becuase MIB says "Jacob made me this way". I am not going to believe it. Who's to say he wasn't always evil, or wasn't evil when Jacob met him?
There are more to both characters then meets the eye, but I just don't trsut MIB. |
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Polarbear Expert Vidder

Joined: 26 Jun 2005 Posts: 13684 Location: having a bowl of brown with Davos
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 5:32 am Post subject: |
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Yeah I was thinking about that. It's certainly possible but it is just as possible that Jacob was a horrible murderous type before he took on that role. It's certainly likely that Jacob was a man before anyways.
Who do you think is the little boy that appeared to MIB? My take on that as Jacob is dead that it is some greater force bigger than MIB and Jacob.. the spirit of the island so to speak.
MIB is manipulative but what has interested me is that he is very straight up with people and doesn't really seem to lie that often. He hasn't shyed away from revealing he is the black smoke to people. I see Jacob as manipulative too the way he treated Hurley in lying to him about why he wanted them to go the lighthouse. Not saying either is good my take on it is that they are both bad although we can sympthasise with them both to some degree.
By the way I always enjoy reading your comments on the episode threads and it's fun debating this. _________________
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FaradayLinus Expert Vidder

Joined: 16 Jun 2009 Posts: 1525
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 5:52 am Post subject: |
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i love both Jacob and MIB. i dont wanna pick just one side lol
i like them more and more since their both equally manipulative ad convincing. good and bad is all relative so far
and the ep, ofc i loved it. i only wished hurley didnt ruin the richard/MIB reunion. isabella was ok but MIBs love for richard was more convincing to me. he saved him afterall, got him out of those chains  |
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Brooke Expert Vidder
Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 24129
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 5:55 am Post subject: |
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FaradayLinus wrote: | i love both Jacob and MIB. i dont wanna pick just one side lol
i like them more and more since their both equally manipulative ad convincing. good and bad is all relative so far
and the ep, ofc i loved it. i only wished hurley didnt ruin the richard/MIB reunion. isabella was ok but MIBs love for richard was more convincing to me. he saved him afterall, got him out of those chains  |
I felt the Hurley/Richard/Isabella scene was so awkward. And it reminded me way too much of the movie Ghost. I think it was way too cheesy. |
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thefilmchick Expert Vidder

Joined: 22 May 2006 Posts: 4030 Location: Albany, NY
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 5:57 am Post subject: |
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You say 'Ghost,' but I was humming 'Tommy, Can You Hear Me?'  _________________ I saw a werewolf drinking a pina colada at Trader Vic's. His hair was perfect.
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Brooke Expert Vidder
Joined: 01 Jul 2008 Posts: 24129
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Posted: Sat Mar 27, 2010 5:59 am Post subject: |
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Polarbear wrote: | Yeah I was thinking about that. It's certainly possible but it is just as possible that Jacob was a horrible murderous type before he took on that role. It's certainly likely that Jacob was a man before anyways.
Who do you think is the little boy that appeared to MIB? My take on that as Jacob is dead that it is some greater force bigger than MIB and Jacob.. the spirit of the island so to speak.
MIB is manipulative but what has interested me is that he is very straight up with people and doesn't really seem to lie that often. He hasn't shyed away from revealing he is the black smoke to people. I see Jacob as manipulative too the way he treated Hurley in lying to him about why he wanted them to go the lighthouse. Not saying either is good my take on it is that they are both bad although we can sympthasise with them both to some degree.
By the way I always enjoy reading your comments on the episode threads and it's fun debating this. |
The boy, a lot of people are speculating it might be Aaron. But I am not buying it. I am wondering if it's Jacob. But then that would remind me way too much of One Tree Hill. Lmao.
One of the reasons why I felt MIB wasn't truthful because he told Sawyer it was just 'an island'. I don't think he really feels that way. I just think he wants off of it.
LOL. I enjoy debating Lost with people, and hearing about their theories.
I liked Titus' portrayal of MIB a lot more then Terry's even though I love Terry. |
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