 |
Lost Video Island
A Multifandom Vidding site
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Rocksiren
Expert Vidder
Joined: 20 Feb 2005
Posts: 2576
|
 Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2006 4:28 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Hahaha yeah gene, I would HATE to have THOSE two guys after me...how horrible!!!! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Hobbes
Council Member
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 11211
Location: Vancouver, BC
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 3:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
If Locke died, hey, at least he fulfills the Shakespearean requirement of a "tragic hero" *points to my AVI for a good example*. Oh, Locke's "recognizing of his fault" was where he had the "stupid" look, it was needed but I don't have to like it |
LOL that is too good a point for me to disagree with 
| Quote: |
OK, "stupid" was the wrong word...hypocrite is a better word. |
I dunno... stupid is still probably a better word, because he should have considered the possibility that the button did something and the whole Pearl thing was just an experiment on the people inside it, not the Swan people (as Desmond suggested) but he never considered it (though then again, nobody else did really  Eko had no reasoning for not wanting him to blow the hatch other than being "told" that it can't happen, and Desmond didn't really explain well, at least not before Locke smashed the computer. So yeah, Locke was kinda being stupid, like a stupid spoiled baby crying because he wasn't the centre of attention anymore (Eko was  lol, what with his visions), but that just makes him more interresting, to me at least And "hypocrite" is kinda for someone who believes in one thign and does another, while Locke fully believed that the button was important when he was forcing it on Jack. Since that point though, he was persuaded otherwise, by nothing happening, by Henry Gale, by the Pearl, etc.
Like Aislynn said, I am oblivious to any flaws in Locke lol, PROVIDED I can understand them. When the writers decide to use him for their own purposes, kinda like in Fire and Water (the Charlie ep where he beats him up) then that is a definite "hit" against him, and one I can't forgive . I'm still kinda unsure about Fire and Water, so I kinda just ignore it but if you wanna take a shot at that one I won't argue  . I'm the same way with the other characters - I just don't like those that don't make sense - and Kate is one of the worst in that sense... (it should be noted that though Sun and Jin make perfect sense, they aren't my favourite characters simply because they bore me but Locke is like the most out-there sense-making character fo the bunch, which is why I like him!  )
| Quote: | | I don't care if that was "his character" type, that never bugged me before but when it affect the larger whole then your "character flaw" is one I don't like. That's all I'm saying. |
Yeah, good point I know what you mean, what with the whole Ana Lucia thing. As soon as she showed up, I knew I would like her eventually, but hated her at first. And once we knew who she was I knew that even though I understood her character, that she just didn't interest me . Too boring . I didn't hate her though.
But I DID hate her for the sheer fact that she killed Shannon. Because I didn't care about what it meant for Ana Lucia, and I was actually interrested in Shannon . I'm guessing it's kinda the same way for yourself with Locke - you're not interrested in what blowing the hatch means/meant for his character, but you sure-as-hell care if Desmond and Eko survive it.
| Quote: | | My only beef is him with the frog, not cause it was uncalled for, but I thought it was just "cheap heat" that the producers wanted to give him. |
Totally with you there! That would be one of those "hits" It just didn't fit...
Kate's like a springboard  whatever she does is just a way to spring up some Jate or Skate - What kate Did: disturbed Kate -Jate Kiss, Sawyer/Kate heart-to-heart moment. It's like they invented the whole ep thinking "how could we please the Jaters and the Skaters at the same time?". Nobody even seems to care what Kate herself thinks or feels or is, because she's just a prop for the Jate and Skate, even with her flashbacks. Get past that, and yeah, I'd like her, but... I don't know, I can't see oast it. Maybe I'm just not looking hard enough
Aislynn: Thanks for the cookie . And just so you know, I love the "Aislynn Kate" . I wish the real Kate was the Aislynn Kate She'd be my fav character then!
| Quote: | | "Oh look I'm Kate, I'm a hardened criminal and 2 desireable men are after my heart but I feel I need to run away all the time *insert flashback of her running away (both literally...and figuratively, OOHHH! SNAP!)*" |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Aislynn
Council Member
Joined: 03 Feb 2005
Posts: 35782
Location: Sawyerville, USA
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 3:51 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Hobbes wrote: | | Aislynn: Thanks for the cookie . And just so you know, I love the "Aislynn Kate" . I wish the real Kate was the Aislynn Kate She'd be my fav character then! |
That line right there redeemed the entire rest of the anti-Kate post...
It sucks because I try so hard to not offend anybody (and hey, every character on the show has somebody who loves them and doesn't want to hear somebody bash 'em, right? ) so that's tying my hands when I'd like to try and salvage some of Kate's character... I can't just say, "Yeah, well look at what Lostie X went and did in HIS/HER episode! How dumb was that????"
Well, I could say that. But then I'd feel bad for all the Lostie X groupies out there. I'd want to bake them all cookies. And that would take, like, forever! 
Let me just say this much: I don't think Kate is the only character who gets the same treatment that you guys are talking about (being a prop for a ship, doing the same things over and over again like falling back on the running away theme, etc.). And I'll leave it at that. *innocent smile* |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Distress Signal
Advanced Vidder
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Posts: 896
Location: NOWHERE! BWAHAHAHAHAHA
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 4:08 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Hobbes wrote: |
| Quote: | | My only beef is him with the frog, not cause it was uncalled for, but I thought it was just "cheap heat" that the producers wanted to give him. |
Totally with you there! That would be one of those "hits" It just didn't fit... |
I still don't get what everyone in the world found so upsetting about that moment. It's just.... a frog. I've seen that happen in movies too. Like O Brother, Where Art Thou? I mean sure, it's a poor animal and that wasn't very nice, but come on! Is it really so horrifying/traumatizing/blaringevilSawyer? It's almost as if people are more upset that Sawyer crushed a damn tree frog than Michael killing Ana Lucia and Libby.
*had to get that out of my system sometime*.... (This is actually more directed at all the Sawyer fangirls I've seen and others)
_________________
sig by IslandofMystery |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Aislynn
Council Member
Joined: 03 Feb 2005
Posts: 35782
Location: Sawyerville, USA
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 4:33 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Distress Signal wrote: | | (This is actually more directed at all the Sawyer fangirls I've seen and others) |
Gee, this just ain't my day...
I agree about all the hysteria over "Sawyer just killed a FROG!" while Sayid was over torturing and beating the snot out of Henry (aka Benry... ) and nobody seemed inclined to post SAYID IS A BIG MEANIE!!!! every place like they did for Sawyer... And it especially doesn't compare with Michael murdering 2 human beings, in my book. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hobbes
Council Member
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 11211
Location: Vancouver, BC
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 4:44 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
Let me just say this much: I don't think Kate is the only character who gets the same treatment that you guys are talking about (being a prop for a ship, doing the same things over and over again like falling back on the running away theme, etc.). And I'll leave it at that. *innocent smile* |
Very very true . Kate is just getting the poster-girl treatment here lol. Sorry
At least we're not bashing Sawyer . Or not really anyway.
| Quote: | Is it really so horrifying/traumatizing/blaringevilSawyer? It's almost as if people are more upset that Sawyer crushed a damn tree frog than Michael killing Ana Lucia and Libby.
|
Actually, I like Micheal a million times more now that his character actually has something interesting to it
It was just a little too far, a little too randomly. Like Sawyer was just having a bad week or something, so he decided to go about stealing guns and killing tree frogs (at the same time ) like the Powers That Be just decided "Sawyer needs to be more badass! He got better ratings when he was badass!" so they stuffed as much badass in as they could in two eps  then never bothered with it since.
I dunno |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
xgene
Advanced Vidder
Joined: 31 Aug 2006
Posts: 176
Location: Bellevue
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 4:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | But I DID hate her for the sheer fact that she killed Shannon. Because I didn't care about what it meant for Ana Lucia, and I was actually interrested in Shannon . I'm guessing it's kinda the same way for yourself with Locke - you're not interrested in what blowing the hatch means/meant for his character, but you sure-as-hell care if Desmond and Eko survive it. |
I know what you mean!! I was actually really getting into Shannon and *bam!* she's gone = I don't care what happens to Ana now. Actually now you bring it up I am interested in what it means but I think for characters that rub me the wrong way I tend not to pay too close attention to them as I do to others, which I think it's fair to say we all do that to some extent. Yes, I do care if Ecko and Desmond survive cause if they don't, you can throw any chance of me trying to like or understand Locke out the window! LoL, j/k
| Quote: | | Kate's like a springboard whatever she does is just a way to spring up some Jate or Skate - What kate Did: disturbed Kate -Jate Kiss, Sawyer/Kate heart-to-heart moment. It's like they invented the whole ep thinking "how could we please the Jaters and the Skaters at the same time?". Nobody even seems to care what Kate herself thinks or feels or is, because she's just a prop for the Jate and Skate, even with her flashbacks. Get past that, and yeah, I'd like her, but... I don't know, I can't see oast it. Maybe I'm just not looking hard enough |
OMG, your logic astounds me!! Then again flashbacks are suppose to explain/parallel the character's habits on the island as well, so it was inevitable that the ep was a Jater/Skater episode. Seeing that my sis is a Kate fan I may have to examine Kate's story better or suffer my sister's wrath.
Hobbes This is one of the better Lost discussions I've had, usually I'm bound to only my Mom (watches just for fun), sister (same as mother) or friends who aren't caught up on the show.
| Quote: | | It sucks because I try so hard to not offend anybody (and hey, every character on the show has somebody who loves them and doesn't want to hear somebody bash 'em, right? ) so that's tying my hands when I'd like to try and salvage some of Kate's character... I can't just say, "Yeah, well look at what Lostie X went and did in HIS/HER episode! How dumb was that????" |
Awww...you're so considerate Aislynn and a total sweetheart I don't wish to say I "hate" any one character as I believe this show is successful because each character is a strong character in their own respect. But being a Jack fan is hard as there are so many haters out there, so I tend to say things that I don't necessarily mean. To say I "hate" Kate is too much...how about I just say I "prefer" other characters for different reasons.
I understand why people connect with certain characters so it becomes a personal thing as well sometimes. I'll just say some characters are too "cliche" so to speak *cough*Charlie*cough*Sayid*cough* doesn't mean they don't have they're good points
| Quote: | | I still don't get what everyone in the world found so upsetting about that moment. It's just.... a frog. I've seen that happen in movies too. Like O Brother, Where Art Thou? I mean sure, it's a poor animal and that wasn't very nice, but come on! Is it really so horrifying/traumatizing/blaringevilSawyer? It's almost as if people are more upset that Sawyer crushed a damn tree frog than Michael killing Ana Lucia and Libby. |
First, I follow a belief that makes it hard for me to kill even a bug without having a guilty conscience. Second, its just a show and I know that so it doesn't really bug me. Third, I don't think you understood me when I said "cheap heat". Being that I believe it was a bad story line to give Sawyer just to get some "heat" (anger etc.) from the audience towards him. Where as an example of good "heat" is Michael killing people as there was a good story to it as well.
_________________
I have spread my dreams under your feet; tread softly because you tread on my dreams. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hobbes
Council Member
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 11211
Location: Vancouver, BC
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 5:42 am Post subject: |
|
|
One last thing before I try to leave Kate alone lol About that whole Kate is a Prop thing
Look at each of her eps:
WKD - her crazy Sawyer-is-Wayne thing led her to a crazed Jate kiss and a personal Skate moment, not to mention that quazi-creepy simillarity of the two to her dads . Her flashbacks were also used to launch the weird horse thing, to keep the Island-interrested people happy. In theory, that makes everyone happy . Unfortunately, Kate doesn't get much time to herself.
Born to Run - the whole on-island thing was Skate. Total "I don't want to go on the raft, but I do, so that makes it okay for you to tell everyone I'm a criminal, especially because I like you". And her flashback was largely about her past boyfriend, who she got killed, so as to set her up as a more sophisticated and experienced girl in the whole dating scene for later Jate/Skate moments... Of course, I'm twisting the truth a bit here and just highlighting that part of this all, but nonetheless.
Whatever the Case May Be - It's a case, Sawyer and Kate find it by their dip in the waterfall (SKATE!!!!!), then Kate goes to all ends to get it from him (ANGSTY SKATE!!!!!). Finally, Jack ends up opening it with her (JATE!!!!!) and learns her little secret, and gets more angst, knowing she killed her boyfriend (ANGSTY JATE!!)
Tabula Rasa - Jack finds out Kate was a criminal. Suddenly their perfect monster-escaping relationship is made much mroe complicated (ANGSTY JAAAAAATE!!!!!), not to mention Sawyer *literally* kills for her (ANGSTY SKATE! )
Kate rarely even interacts with someone besides Sawyer and Jack, except to be some prop for something else (eg. the shoulder for Sun to lean on when she finds out she's pregnant, or the protector of the group when Claire and the girls go out to find medicine for the baby)
To me, it doesn't seem like Kate has much to her, besides being hard to get, and thus the perfect girl for (not one but ) two relationships that can span throughout the Lost series without any resolutiion happening. She seems like a writing tool to make Sawyer and Jack m ore interresting, and she does! But remove them and what does she look like? You know, I actually don't know the answer to that. All I can picture her doing is saying "Where's Sawyer and Jack" from this ep or maybe later, once she's given up, being some sort of quazi-leader to the group, or else just moving on to another guy (Sayid looks lonely ).
I'd like to be able to like Kate for what she is now, but I just don't see what that is.
| Quote: | | To say I "hate" Kate is too much...how about I just say I "prefer" other characters for different reasons. |
Ditto. I don't hate Kate. Hate would imply strong emotions towards the character. I hated Ana Lucia when she first came on, but I'm pretty sure we were "meant" to hate her, what with the whole "Ooooh, I'm better than you! Watch me prove how better I am by shooting Shannon!" (PS. not an actual quote )
| Quote: | | I understand why people connect with certain characters so it becomes a personal thing as well sometimes. I'll just say some characters are too "cliche" so to speak *cough*Charlie*cough*Sayid*cough* doesn't mean they don't have they're good points |
Totally with you on that, except I Charlie and Sayid aren't on the bottom of my totem pole exactly, since Charlie is one of those chars I just love to hate . Yet another example of personal connections. I know I for one don't pay as close attention and really think about the motives of the characters I don't care about as much, and that's probably a large reason why I don't like them as much.
I heard in some show that the opposite of Love isn't Hate, it's Indifference. Kinda true.
| Quote: |
Hobbes This is one of the better Lost discussions I've had, usually I'm bound to only my Mom (watches just for fun), sister (same as mother) or friends who aren't caught up on the show. |
LOL thank you That really helps me feel like I'm not just saying these things to make Aislynn's avatar cry  As that would definitely be the last thing I'd want to needlessly do  . I too am having a good discussion, and you express your points very well .
You gotta love it once the Lost Ep discussions get into the 5th page and onwards because you just know that the discussion is gonna be all rhetorical and have nothing to do with the actual episode we're discussing LOL |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Rocksiren
Expert Vidder
Joined: 20 Feb 2005
Posts: 2576
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 1:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think Im the only one in the universe who liked Ana, lol.
But in summary to all these really great posts (wow we actually have a worthy discussion here rather than a bunch of hysteria!)
Locke- you know how I feel. He is very reactionary, and is often a hypocrite (as are many of the characters on the show). Again I laughed out LOUD when he said "I was wrong!" hahahhahaa!
Though really, besides "masking" the island, what did the giant magnet-generator-thingy *do*?
Sawyer- I agree, it was totally like "cheap heat", pretty unecessary. Sorry but Im a sucker for animals, totally have been since the day I was born. Plus I did live in Bermuda AND Hawaii, where those frogs are everywhere (I laughed my ass off at the prospect of there just being "one" all of a sudden) and after a few days, you get used to them. I actually missed them when I came home to Buffalo. And also, yeah I like animals...sorry...Im one of those people that are upset in movies when someone's dog gets it, even though people are being butchered one after another.
Ais- im with you on the Kate issue. I completley get why people dont like her, and thats cool. I really didnt care for Shannon (thought basically she was a bitch and really dumb). But Ive tried to not like Kate, but I still like her. She acts like a moron sometimes (as does everybody else on the show) but I still like her...However, I dont think anyone felt bad about Henry because we all knew what he was about. Several people had been killed/taken by the Others, and he was holding out info. Maybe Sayid did go a little too far, but apparently it wasnt far enough- he still killed the real Henry and orchestrated all the bad events to come. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Distress Signal
Advanced Vidder
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Posts: 896
Location: NOWHERE! BWAHAHAHAHAHA
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 5:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| xgene wrote: |
First, I follow a belief that makes it hard for me to kill even a bug without having a guilty conscience. Second, its just a show and I know that so it doesn't really bug me. Third, I don't think you understood me when I said "cheap heat". Being that I believe it was a bad story line to give Sawyer just to get some "heat" (anger etc.) from the audience towards him. Where as an example of good "heat" is Michael killing people as there was a good story to it as well. |
I said I was more directing at other posts in other forums and stuff I've read over a long time, I was just getting my thoughts and frustrations out on the topic. I really wasn't trying to offend you or Hobbes. Or Aislynn. *sigh*.......
At first I was mad that Shannon died and wanted to see Sayid inflict major pain on Ana, but then I started liking her. She wasn't as girly or whats-the-word.... in lack of a better word, submissive as Kate. At least in my opinion, she made herself out to be a more interesting character. I was actually shocked and a little disappointed when Michael shot her.
Wow, there seems to be a lot of Locke hate here.....
_________________
sig by IslandofMystery |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
xgene
Advanced Vidder
Joined: 31 Aug 2006
Posts: 176
Location: Bellevue
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 6:18 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Distress Signal wrote: |
I said I was more directing at other posts in other forums and stuff I've read over a long time, I was just getting my thoughts and frustrations out on the topic. I really wasn't trying to offend you or Hobbes. Or Aislynn. *sigh*....... |
You haven't offended anyone, or at least not me. Gosh I really need to start using those smiley faces to calm my posts down Stupid impersonal internet...Anyways, keep coming with your thoughts/frustrations it's all good, not trying to hinder you there.
Hobbes LoL, talk about critical analysis on poor Kate. LoL Very good points, but there maybe a small ray of light through your dark cloud shrouding Kate, don't worry though, you're not alone
| Quote: | | I know I for one don't pay as close attention and really think about the motives of the characters I don't care about as much, and that's probably a large reason why I don't like them as much. |
Exactly (Hmmm, did I say something like that before?) So in that respect it's not "fair" to judge them as there are others who like the characters who probably know more than we do, but the point is that the character to begin with was of little interest to___(insert name here). Totally know where you're coming from.
| Quote: | | You gotta love it once the Lost Ep discussions get into the 5th page and onwards because you just know that the discussion is gonna be all rhetorical and have nothing to do with the actual episode we're discussing LOL |
LoL, oops But hey, it's now a place to talk about the nitty-gritty-details...until the next episode airs and a new thread is made
| Quote: | | Locke- you know how I feel. He is very reactionary, and is often a hypocrite (as are many of the characters on the show). Again I laughed out LOUD when he said "I was wrong!" hahahhahaa! |
Rocksiren OMG!! I can't believe somone else shares my views on him Wait, did Henry (Ben) actually kill the real Henry? I didn't catch that if so. LoL, I totally can relate in some aspects towards the death of animals compared to humans in movies. Mainly in thrasher movies cause you already know 10+ people are gonna die and you just want to see the creativity in their deaths, lol. But oh, poor animals if they get slaughtered in the process. Haha, that's kind of morbid...[/quote]
_________________
I have spread my dreams under your feet; tread softly because you tread on my dreams.
Last edited by xgene on Wed Oct 11, 2006 7:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Aislynn
Council Member
Joined: 03 Feb 2005
Posts: 35782
Location: Sawyerville, USA
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2006 11:42 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Hobbes wrote: | | One last thing before I try to leave Kate alone lol |
Too late. Look what you did...
I hope all of you are happy. You made Kate cry. 
| Hobbes wrote: | About that whole Kate is a Prop thing
Look at each of her eps |
Gah, Warren! You're killing me and my "trying not to insult other characters in the name of defending Kate" thing, here! 
*sigh* I actually wrote up a long argument, naming names of other characters whom I feel get the same treatment that Kate does but, honestly? It's not worth it to post it, so I'll let it go. Suffice it to say, I don't think that Kate is the only character who's suffered a bit at the hands of the writers. However, you and anybody else are certainly entitled to dislike her whatever varying degrees from mild all the way up to full-on hate as you see fit.
*sound of Aislynn taking the high road* |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Hobbes
Council Member
Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 11211
Location: Vancouver, BC
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 3:15 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | I think Im the only one in the universe who liked Ana, lol. |
lol, well, by the end, I liked her. Didn't love her though. Kinda tough due to the Shannon killing thing.
| Quote: | | I did live in Bermuda AND Hawaii, where those frogs are everywhere (I laughed my ass off at the prospect of there just being "one" all of a sudden) |
LOL me too I seem to have somehow forgot abotu that. Cheap heat that doesn't make sense... that's like, the Ultimate Offense
| Quote: |
I said I was more directing at other posts in other forums and stuff I've read over a long time, I was just getting my thoughts and frustrations out on the topic. I really wasn't trying to offend you or Hobbes. Or Aislynn. *sigh*....... |
No worries, no offense taken at least not from me. Sorry if I made it sound like there was .
| Quote: | | Wow, there seems to be a lot of Locke hate here..... |
It's just another day's work for the *dun dun dun DUN!* Locke Protectors! (boy, just wait until the next ep that mentions Boone we'll be rolling in it then . Eeep, I just mentioned him Nevermind, nevermind!
| Quote: |
Exactly (Hmmm, did I say something like that before?) So in that respect it's not "fair" to judge them as there are others who like the characters who probably know more than we do, but the point is that the character to begin with was of little interest to___(insert name here). Totally know where you're coming from. |
lol you might have. This is why it kinda falls to each individual who likes each character to do the defending... which is why a lot of this gets too personal
| Quote: | | Wait, did Henry (Ben) actually kill the real Henry? I didn't catch that if so. |
It was implied, but nto confirmed, or even confirmed he was definitely murdered.
| Quote: | | I hope all of you are happy. You made Kate cry. |
I'm sorry Kate I didn't say that just to make you cry . I just want to understand your character better to make me like you, but I am having difficulties doing so! . As for my official stance, I don't dislike Kate at all, I just don't love her as much as some characters, and I don't see why I should, that's all . She's still an excellent supporting character in my book though .
I hope the "Aislynn Kate" avi isn't sad too  (is that avi Harry made laughing or crying btw? )
| Quote: |
*sound of Aislynn taking the high road* |
Ais, you're better than us all |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
xgene
Advanced Vidder
Joined: 31 Aug 2006
Posts: 176
Location: Bellevue
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 8:06 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Hobbes wrote: |
| Quote: | | I hope all of you are happy. You made Kate cry. |
I'm sorry Kate I didn't say that just to make you cry . I just want to understand your character better to make me like you, but I am having difficulties doing so! . As for my official stance, I don't dislike Kate at all, I just don't love her as much as some characters, and I don't see why I should, that's all . She's still an excellent supporting character in my book though .
I hope the "Aislynn Kate" avi isn't sad too (is that avi Harry made laughing or crying btw? ) |
Couldn't say it better myself, though I disagree on her being a supporting character since I consider Jack, Sawyer, Kate the "big 3" (reference to DC Comics, WOOO!! I'm a nerd)
Unless smiling is the new crying I believe it's a more of a "blushing" type reaction laugh.
| Quote: | | *sound of Aislynn taking the high road* |
Just cause people may hate/don't care for Kate, doesn't mean we hate you or are intentionally trying to attack you through a character
| Quote: | | Ais, you're better than us all |
All too true, maybe you should leave us to our "sandbox" Just kidding.
_________________
I have spread my dreams under your feet; tread softly because you tread on my dreams. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Aislynn
Council Member
Joined: 03 Feb 2005
Posts: 35782
Location: Sawyerville, USA
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 10:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| xgene wrote: | | Quote: | | Ais, you're better than us all |
All too true, maybe you should leave us to our "sandbox" Just kidding. |
You know, I didn't think about it at the time but my "high road" comment probably sounded like I meant I was "above" everybody else who was taking part in this discussion and I didn't mean it that way AT ALL. I was struggling with my own "darker and better angels" as too how much and how strongly to present my Kate defense. And after I'd launched into this lovely, long, detailed rebuttal, I realized that it wasn't worth it to finish it, so I took my own personal "high road" rather than risk offending anybody by what I was going to say. That was what I meant by that, not me being better than anybody else, or anything like that! Hopefully, though, you guys knew that already...
Anyway, I gotta agree with gene on this one, Warren. If Kate wasn't being considered one of the main characters, she might get better treatment as a supporting character. As it is, right now she's trapped as "the girl" in the big love triangle. (Warning: part of my long, detailed defense ahead... ) As capably as Kate is written (she's tough, she climbs trees, shoots guns -- though apparently can't outshoot a doctor -- and all that), she's still caught in a bit of a cliche: a woman's world revolves around The Man. Or The Men, in this case.
If you slid any of the other female characters into this slot, I'd bet you dollars for donuts that they'd suffer from the same "passive" problem that you've pointed out in Kate. (And I would also argue the point that if you'd put any other character, male or female, into Kate's position going off with Claire and Danielle in "Maternity Leave," that they wouldn't have added any more substantially to the story than Kate did as the protector of the group. )
Am I calling the writers sexist? Nah. It's just sometimes easier to fall into familiar patterns and that's one of them. I'm hoping that Kate will get to be a bit more pro-active in the coming eps. (I don't hold it against her that she was kinda weepy in this last ep: if I'd been in a plane crash, survived polar bears and black smoke monsters, then been kidnapped, had my clothes taken away and burned, been shot full of an unknown drug AND had Henry "Benry" Gale tell me that I was getting to eat breakfast with him in handcuffs as a "nice memory" to hold onto because the next few weeks were going to be full of implied torture, well, I would've been a blubbering idiot as opposed to Xena Warrior Princess, I'm afraid! ) And I still think that whatever cause that awful needle mark on her arm is affecting her reactions as well. But that's just speculation on my part.
I could also argue the point that ALL of the other characters act as props at one time or another. However, I'll refrain from naming names and siting examples. I DO get your point, however. But, it's like with anything, if you like the character, you'll forgive them quite a bit. (I can only imagine what you'd say about Locke and his "I was wrong-ing" if it would've been KATE who'd said and done the things he'd done... )
*steps out of the sandbox, returns to baking cookies* |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
