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The *OFFICIAL* Skate vs Jate Debate!
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My choice for the Kate/Sawyer/Jack love triangle IS:
Sawyer & Kate (SKATE)
46%
 46%  [ 7 ]
Jack and Kate (Jate)
46%
 46%  [ 7 ]
I have not decided! CONVINCE ME!
6%
 6%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 15

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FrecklesPhoenix
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 4:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why thank you Ais...

*This random outpouring of opinions was brought to you by Cindy finishing my awesome Skate banner.

Just as a side note, I think the lyrics of that song (in my banner) really sum up Skate well...

"LO-VE- It's a mystery- Where you'll find me- Is where you'll find-
All is love, is love, is love, is love!"

It's from Where the Wild Things Are, and Sawyer and Kate are definitely wild things!
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Debbie
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 6:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FrecklesPhoenix wrote:
I can't believe that in all of my LOST watching time and time here on LVI I have never once entered this thread and voiced an opinion (well, written my opinion...).

So here it goes, I FRIGGEN LOVE ME SOME SKATE!!!

Just in case that wasn't completely obvious already by my banner, avi, and vidding choices... I just love them. Why?

Because... their like gravity... all it needs is a little push!!! Just like the Joker says... except he was talking about madness, not love and he was crazy and I'm not! Anyway, I really believe that there is just a huge amount of love between them. Not that I don't think there is a huge amount of love between her and Jack, I do (mostly coming from his side though, more on that later). But I feel that Sawyer deserves her more.

Why you ask? Why should this con artist a-hole get the girl? Because he's not that man anymore. He has evolved so much over the course of this program that I'm astounded that the focus hasn't shifted more toward him being the main character instead of Jack. I don't pretend to believe that all of his growth is due to Kate. There were a lot of things that factored in to his character change. However, I do believe that she taught him what true, healthy love is. I believe that he loved Cassidy, so he had experienced love before. But it wasn't enough love, or a healthy love, because he ended up screwing her over. Obviously something wasn't right there. But with Kate it was different. He opened up with her more than any other person in his life (that we know of). Even when he lied to her, the truth eventually came out and he was straight forward with her. As further evidence that he grew because of her, I think that his love for her grew to a point that he had never known before, a point in which he put the needs of another person ahead of his own. In his life, he'd always been number 1, most important, it's every man for himself. But with her things changed. He started making decisions based on her needs/feelings.

So, back to how I think the love between Jack and Kate comes more from him than her... I feel that she does love him. However, I don't think it's the right kind of love, it's not healthy. He doesn't trust her (and there is some validity to that, she is a criminal) and she wants him to and expects him to and it doesn't work. They don't function well because he's too busy being self righteous to notice her needs. I think that he really loves her and wants her to be his, but I don't think he can handle her for who she really is. I think he is in love with the woman he thinks she ought to be. I think she loves the idea of being that woman for him, but she just can't bring herself to do it.

Did any of that make sense? I just love Sawyer and Kate and I love them together and I hope that they at least get some closure by the end of this, whether they end up in a permanent relationship or not.



excuse me...but I friggin love you after that!
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klost004
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This was a beautiful Jate essay I skimmed when I had the chance...

http://copulators.livejournal.com/531.html

obviously it's in favor of jate, but it seems to try to give some understanding to skate moments...*shrugs* I dunno it's an interesting read...but I'm also fond of both ships so i enjoyed it...then again I favor jate slightly more...so maybe I enjoyed it a little more...lmao...either way...
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littleton_pace
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 6:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wow, that's an epic essay! im still reading it but she makes some excellent points, and I love how she portrays Skate becuase its not negative-skate at all. I love the point she made about Kate healing Sawyer, because I think she did that too, he wouldnt be who he was without her.

i also loved where she made the point that even after jate broke up in the future, kate wouldnt go back to the island even knowing sawyer was alive; she would rather stay and wait for Jack to return to her. I hadn't thought of it that way, it does make the whole future Jate thing easier to stomach And she used EPIC quotes too not just from Evi, but all of them
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Debbie
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't read the whole essay yet, cause I'm just awake and that would be task for me certainly looks like an interestng read.

From what Kat mentioned there I would disagree witht hat point. Off island Kate wasn't about Jack. She was about Aaron. Kate needed Aaron, and she at that point wasn't willing to give up having him. Kates growth of island would be be put down to nothing if we simply just said "she was waiting for jack to return to her". If that's the case then there truely was no development for Kate. Just sitting around waiting on Jack calling the shots.

And she did develop so I know that's not true. Kate was in control.

I'll go further into this when I'm actually fully awake and feeling human
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littleton_pace
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The jate stuff is shown as she still has that photo up even after the jate break up; because she stills wants him in her life. I don't think Kate was ever really about Aaron, especially at the start; she took him to fill the void in her heart. She took him for herself, not for him. And she accepts that in 5x11 when she tells Cassidy she eventually expected him to be taken when she loses him at the market, because she knew she took him for the wrong reasons. But that goes in the pile of a million reasons why it made no sense to me for Kate, who I will point out I love by the way, to have Aaron, which is a new thread in itself ;P
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Debbie
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

littleton_pace wrote:
The jate stuff is shown as she still has that photo up even after the jate break up; because she stills wants him in her life. I don't think Kate was ever really about Aaron, especially at the start; she took him to fill the void in her heart. She took him for herself, not for him. And she accepts that in 5x11 when she tells Cassidy she eventually expected him to be taken when she loses him at the market, because she knew she took him for the wrong reasons. But that goes in the pile of a million reasons why it made no sense to me for Kate, who I will point out I love by the way, to have Aaron, which is a new thread in itself ;P


wanting to have him in her life, and sitting idle waiting on him coming back are different things. I think Kate has shown in the past she does things like that (keeping the toy plane for example). Kate was all about keep Aaron to herself. She put Aaron before Jack imo.

I do agree her reasoning for taking/keeping aaron were to take up a certain persons place.

I'm not trying to deny Jate here, as I prefer them over many ships on Lost. But I do think that there are some people who ship Jate (no one here of course) that act as if EVERYTHING Kate does is about Jack. Which is really untrue.Don't get me wrong, I've seen Skaters do it to but not to the extent that the opposing ship does. As a huge Kate fan, I really hate that. Cause she is her own charcter and I really think that the writers have tried to give Kate her own unique storyline away from the triangle. But everything she does automatically gets put to "She's staying cause she loves Jack, She's back cause she loves Sawyer".

I'm still sleepy so I'm not really able to explain this as best as I wish I could at the moment. I should probs try and write something up for both ships. I've found a respect for Jate during rewatch, after seeing the whole Suliet thing. It really showed that the two ships we're supposed to care about is Jate and Skate. They have both had a fantstic build up and have their own unique relationships.

and it's all about Kate...of course



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littleton_pace
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know what you mean, I'm a definite Jater but im not one of those I think Kate is much too strong and independent to be swayed by either man. I also don't like when I watch the show, and it does seem like she's swaying to either man, it annoys me. In some ways I'd rather she didn't end up with either of them, the feminist won't allow it, lols But I know the show can't go that way, since the bulk of viewers want Jate or Skate as endgame

I don't get Suliet, I just don't buy the chemistry, but that's just me. ;P
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Debbie
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

littleton_pace wrote:
I know what you mean, I'm a definite Jater but im not one of those I think Kate is much too strong and independent to be swayed by either man. I also don't like when I watch the show, and it does seem like she's swaying to either man, it annoys me. In some ways I'd rather she didn't end up with either of them, the feminist won't allow it, lols But I know the show can't go that way, since the bulk of viewers want Jate or Skate as endgame

I don't get Suliet, I just don't buy the chemistry, but that's just me. ;P



typing my Skate/Jate piece as we speak. You may like
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pruedens
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

the essay is a matsrpiece!!!!

anyways.....i wont start writing why jate marks the line for me as couple but its obvious in season 5 [for those who hadnt see it] in many occasions jack showed he trusted her if jack didnt trusted her he wouldnt accept to not ask about Aaron , he would persue for answers but he knows Kate was "mother" for Aaron and she will never hurt him besides in TLP he said " Aaron is my family "too" meaning he knows aaron is important piece for kate but is important for him as well.

when he defended her in Roger - i know Kate she wouldnt never hurt your son- in Sawyer - her heart was in the right place. In Namaste Jack treated Kate as equal when sawyer wants to take them in Dharma jack asked her _what do you think ? aka he wanted her opinion in that. In the variable Jack wanted from Kate to make her own decisions .and talk for herself - she can say whatever she wants to say

for me the finale showed how much Jack is in pain - i had her / i had her and i lost her
Kate was in bad position this season....more like zombie kate ... i dont think jack manipulated her in the finale .he reminded her why she came back....its all free will kate could easily decline isnt like she is a puppy who does what jack says cause in FTL very hard she went angainst his plan.....because she didnt approve it but the fact jack wanted from her to believe in him and the fact how calm kate was with him after the Bernand/Rose convo showed me she isnt over him...at all .

Jack&Kate have many things unresolved and in way thats gives me the point to keep wanting things even though its the last season and i dont think they will keep up so much with the love things..is getting stupid and annoyed in a way..
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Jate815
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pruedens wrote:


Jack&Kate have many things unresolved and in way thats gives me the point to keep wanting things even though its the last season and i dont think they will keep up so much with the love things..is getting stupid and annoyed in a way..


That's why I want the writers to set an ending to the triangle very early in the 6th season! I just need to see some more peaceful jate interaction, no interruptions, no more fights etc. And maybe a Jaby? Ah, wishful thinking
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FaradayLinus
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Debbie wrote:


wanting to have him in her life, and sitting idle waiting on him coming back are different things. I think Kate has shown in the past she does things like that (keeping the toy plane for example). Kate was all about keep Aaron to herself. She put Aaron before Jack imo.


even evi said "Her bond with Jack is stronger than her bond with Aaron.
and that what will bring her to her knees. It'll be her bond with Jack"

i think she used Aaron as a crutch so it would seem like her priority shifted, but it never really did
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Debbie
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FaradayLinus wrote:
Debbie wrote:


wanting to have him in her life, and sitting idle waiting on him coming back are different things. I think Kate has shown in the past she does things like that (keeping the toy plane for example). Kate was all about keep Aaron to herself. She put Aaron before Jack imo.


even evi said "Her bond with Jack is stronger than her bond with Aaron.
and that what will bring her to her knees. It'll be her bond with Jack"

i think she used Aaron as a crutch so it would seem like her priority shifted, but it never really did


as much as I wish I could agree with you. I can't. The reason being that I always think that the actors on the show have thier own take on what happens, just like the viewers. It's the reason I've not been flipping out about josh's skate comments in his recent interview.

I don't think the whole "Aaron" thing is all that obviously clear at all. we all have our own perceptions of it.
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mfirefly10
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

*raises hand*

Can I pick 'neither'?

Honestly, I've always preferred Kate with Claire .

Although I think Kate has loved both Sawyer and Jack at different points during the series, neither man seems to bring out the best in her. Kate's best moments on the show, at least for me, come when she's looking after Claire and then Aaron.

I'd love to see them end up as one happy little family . I doubt it'll happen, but it'd be nice if Aaron could have both of his mommies.
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riay_night
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 17, 2010 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I say I am THROUGH with Jate/Skate. SULIET. And for any of you who know me, remember how I disliked Juliet with a passion? NOW, I love her.

I still LOVE Jate deep down in my heart, but lord, by the end of season five they were SO retarded I couldn't stand it. In my ideal world, it ends up Suliet and Jate. But I like Suliet better as a ship, and think that they are a better couple.
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